New York Times "debunkes" Pizzagate again in new article ( pizzagate )

submitted by ploppy

Can anyone go through this and debunk the debunkers?

Dissecting the #PizzaGate Conspiracy Theories http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/12/10/business/media/pizzagate.html?_r=0

comeonpeople

You clearly don't understand how police sketches work or how witness descriptions work, and you don't want to believe what has been made explicit time and time again.

Enjoy pretending you're an investigator and spending your days in this circle jerk with other pretend investigators who do nothing and accomplish nothing other than demonstrating to others their own irrationality, lunacy, and idiocy.

comeonpeople

In 2007, John was 58 and Tony was 67.

Why do you pretend to be an "investigator" when you can't be bothered to get the most basic facts right?

it is literally impossible to come up with such a close likeness if they are not the same people or people who look like them.

lol. Apparently not.

throwawaymade4pizza

All is takes is a simple Google search to find out John Podesta is currently 67 and Tony Podesta is currently 73 so how, may I ask, were John 67 and Tony 58 in 2007 (NINE years ago)?

comeonpeople

My bad, math fail. John was 58 (as I said) and Tony was 64 (not 67 as I said).

comeonpeople

They "debunk" by saying it's based on one suspect, not two. Okay, then, nothing to see here.

Yes, to a rational person, finding out that images are different renderings of one man who was 20-40, rather than two men 58-67, would indeed be conclusive evidence that it's pure coincidence that they look anything like the Podesta brothers.

21yearsofdigging

Come on, this is a complete smear job psyop. No Instagram photos of the babies(ho tard) and the child duck taped to the table??This is exactly why we have to be so careful what we put out there as it will be spun

BestRolledAgent

That article was super weak.

the "claims they debunked" are none of our biggest claims.

They show the most innocent emails about having a dinner. Of course there are clean emails.

Can we show someone at the NYTimes a few other choice Podesta emails. Have some of those debunked.

pizzathrowaway

People won't like this and will accuse me of shilling but when NYT reprints the original source of the "code talk" words and doesn't even try to argue that it is fake, that is because they think their readers will immediately understand it as not a reliable source. Until you get reliable confirmation of that code, (urban dictionary does not count) many people will find it all unconvincing.

noElbittowers

There are other clues of this code, namely the Olsen twins pizza video, Katy Perry handing out pizza to children at every single concert, Miley and Katy in pizza jumpsuits, etc. Evidence of that is endless, and everywhere. Even that evidence is designed to make the person who sees it look like a fool. People aren't going to look at the creepy Olsen video themselves, it seems absurd that clues would be hidden in pop stars.

pizzathrowaway

Are you actually serious about the Olson Twins video?!?!?

noElbittowers

On the same note, I'm also weary about encouraging people to look at the Olsen video. The people who made it were intentionally graphic and gross. Its so awful, it almost exudes it onto the person that watches it. I watched it a few times, partially in sheer disbelief and partially because one can decode what certain words mean (stereotypical beliefs about food and ethnicity correlate with the type of child). I'm not linking or watching that thing again though, because I realized the absolute terror it made me feel was intentional. They get kicks out of being very open about their perversions and getting away with it.

I also know that if I wouldn't have looked and seen myself, I'd probably view someone taking clues from holly wood as nutty. They have pulled this off masterfully well.

llm2016

Obvious shill is obvious.

cmor88

@ploppy archive.is, don't give NYTs page views. http://archive.is/0trLo

micha_

Isn't it funny, that the NYT is SPECULATING about the Podesta emails, while they could simply call Podesta and demand an explanation? Or even better, make an interview? Btw, where is Podesta?

noElbittowers

spot on..... where is he?

PanamaRed

Oh the bit about the framed photo in the white house was hilarious. As if that picture would be good enough to be framed, with awkward looking staffers behind it and the blurry paddle. Then they feel the need to show us hanging on some random wall, hahaha

pizzathrowaway

That wall is at the White House.

PanamaRed

Oh absolutely. I'm suggesting that I highly doubt Jimmy Comet took a picture of a picture. White House is covering this up too it seems.

pizzathrowaway

Well, so the picture in the hallway is clearly the same picture as Alefantis took, except at a higher resolution/quality and uncropped. So it's not like they could do that retroactively!

PanamaRed

Yes, it looks like you're right. In the NYT article they mention a man named Timmy La. A quick Google search reveals that this picture has indeed been at the white house since some time in 2011. Still an odd picture though...

QuestionEverything

DISINFORMATION: "However, the two e-fits were based on descriptions of a single suspect by two witnesses, not two different suspects, a crucial detail that was left out." -Absolute lie. Suffolk police and SY have refused to clarify this. Instead they use the phrasing: " We are unable to distingush' for all questions- THEY ARE GAGGED. The MI5 from MCCanns investigation have CONFIRMED A GAG ORDER IS IN EFFECT.

These EFITS were made from 10+ witnesses, and they describe 4 suspicious men and 1 woman. THESE ARE NOT EFITs of the same person.

comeonpeople

Bullshit.

The fucking HEAD OF THE INVESTIGATION spelled this out for you on the live BBC Crimewatch special. https://youtu.be/OZ8jmdWlB8Y?t=23m34s

This is why it's so hilarious that all you "investigators" have desperately clung to those efits for so long as a critical piece of your "investigation".

QuestionEverything

You really should have heard all the BS they rallied around SAVILLE proclaiming his innocence..

HOW DARE you would accuse HIM!

FUCK you and your naive displacing of facts from commentary on the BBC- which clarifies NOTHING. They literally seem to shut down every pedo investigation they open.

comeonpeople

This has nothing to do with the BBC. The head of the investigation said the efits are two renderings of one man 20-40. The end. You wouldn't even have ever seen the efits if he didn't release them, why the fuck would he release them but then lie about what they show?

God damn you people are so fucking stupid it's unreal.

QuestionEverything

McCanns whole detective team is MI5. Are you disputing this?

Do you dispute there is a gag order? Because they have stated it publicly.

They are using doubletalk to avoid clarifying facts: "We can't "DISTINGUISH" details.( ?! Are you kidding me?! )

There were multiple witnesses who made efits. And more than two efits were made of people of suspicion. At least 4 were made. From dozens of interviews, several stories stood out as possibly significant. "the waiting man" " The man carrying child" "The ugly man". Of all the fits made TWO WERE HELD BACK 5 YEARS.

What you think you watch on that shitty BBC show is how they handle gag orders, deflect interest, and cover up pedophiles. LIKE SAVILLE.

comeonpeople

We are talking about THESE TWO efits. Not every efit related to the case. The day these efits were revealed to the public, it was explained that they were two renderings of one man who was seen by a married couple, who said he was 20-40 years old.

I love the lunacy implied by believing that they are being forced to cover up the Podesta involvement while simultaneously being told to go right ahead and release two pictures "of the Podestas" as suspects on national TV.

QuestionEverything

THEY HID THE EFITS for FIVE YEARS YOU FUCKING MORON.

Wrap your tiny head around that fact.

comeonpeople

Yeah, they were forced to cover it up for five years, then the superiors decided "eh, let's not cover it up anymore" so they released the efits, but they said "well, let's sort of cover it up, we'll release the efits, but we'll say they're of just one person, and we'll say the witnesses said it was one guy 20-40 and hope they never contradict us publicly".

Brilliant.

QuestionEverything

THATS YOUR EXPLANATION?

lol. Go awaY SHILL.

iTS PRETTY FUCKING OBVIOUS WHY THEY GOT RELEASED, BUT YOU'D NEED A BRAIN TO FIGURE THAT OUT..

HolyMoly0

Do you have a source?

QuestionEverything

Suffolk police. Who got quoted in a printed piece. Who NOW won't answer any questions. LIKE THE NYPD, Because they are gagged.

Go ask. You'll get a harassment charge.

Trump incoming..

PanamaRed

I'm confused about part 6 and seven. What exactly disqualified it from being true? The logic gap here is astounding.

MeatballPizza

I really think this article was a mistake. They posted the "Kill Room" Instagram page. You can see "KILL ROOM" and "MURDER" in the comments. They didnt explain what a "PIZZA-RELATED HANDKERCHIEF" is. I think this is way too much information for the NYT to put out there. Archive it as it'll likely be altered or deleted later today.

Lunari

Yeah, I found that quite bizarre that they chose to show the handkerchief email - yet didn't bother to fucking explain anything "debunking" it..... they treat it as if everyone obviously knows what a "Pizza-Related Handkerchief" is! It's a common, completely normal phrase! No reason to question it, since there's absolutely nothing strange or out of the ordinary about it - right?

MeatballPizza

Exactly.

I think this was a big screw up by the NEW YORK TIMES. Did they put these images into a print edition? Can anyone verify?

If so, MAJOR mistake. Kill room. #Murder. The weird emails.

Despite using conclusory terms any thinking individual reading that story would say, "WTF!" and go searching on the net.

MeatballPizza

You can find the original 'kill room' and other instagram photos here: http://themillenniumreport.com/2016/11/james-achilles-alefantis-and-his-comet-ping-pong-network/

MeatballPizza

The "KILL ROOM" photo doesn't match the 'debunking' photos. Different floors. Different space.

SIMONBARROW

When are they going to talk about the three girls in the hot tub?

oldskeptic

Has that refrigerator box at Buck's ever once been cleaned? Look at the thick black crust on the floor!

https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2016/12/07/pizzagate/3f14313c9c057c74455282dac95980c010758210/images/comet-fridge.jpg

Disgusting. But hey, thanks to NYT, now we know.

micha_

Hey, what do you say about the top restauranteur in DC? Nobody comes close to Alefantis' standards!

eMalum

Our health inspector would instantly fine us for storing food on the floor of our walk-in cooler.

But hey, if you're running a pedo ring, who gives a shit if you don't meet code?

micha_

Tell your health inspector the next time, that he has the wrong priorities and show him that pic! :D

smoothassilk

the most telling email for me (pool heated, uber escorted kids for further entertainment) is never mentioned in any of these articles, instead they pick up the madleine case often which is absolutly bullshit in my eyes too. I am certain that madleine has nothing to do with pizzagate at all.

beepinboopin

It has been for me, too. Much weirder than the "thanks for the cheese box" email, and way more concrete than Madeleine McCann. Which is why they're ignoring it!

CrackerJacks

Found it funny that they only used the walnut emails and not others where is says "domino's on pizza or pasta"

I'd like to see them explain that one away.

Edit: I also think that may bring more people to look into this......The e-fits of the Podesta's look so much like their pictures it will make people wonder.

this_somuchthis

weak ass 'debunking'.

kneo24

This is just a disinformation campaign. Look at how many times they keep claiming "fake stories" without actually discussing said stories or posting any links to them. It's exactly what they did before.

angryindividual

Does anyone want to collaboratively dissect THEIR arguments with a counter? I like how they believe they disproved by pulling out actual wrong elements.

Comet Ping Pong is not the CENTER.

THEY DIDN'T EXPLAIN SHIT. Do people really buy these half-assed explanations?

IT TOOK THREE PEOPLE TO WRITE THIS? C. Kang is there, too! Fuck, they are brazen bastards.

eMalum

First thing that really stood out to me is:

This walk-in cooler: https://i.sli.mg/86mWlT.png

Is not the same cooler as this one: https://i.sli.mg/Dbw8xX.jpg

Different ventilation systems, located on different walls. The "kill room" is much larger/longer than the standard walk-in depicted in the NYTimes article.

Soooo... that pretty much debunks that argument.

HolyMoly0

No, read it carefully: they say that this refrigerator is different. This one is at Bucks. The kill room is supposedly at a restaurant Alefantis "was considering leasing." (According to Comet spokesman).

eMalum

Fair enough. Still doesn't dispel (or even mention) the comments made about the walk-in "kill room" cooler.

It's a simple bait and switch.

HolyMoly0

Maybe.

pizzathrowaway

They did not claim it was the same room. In fact they say clearly that is not.

MeatballPizza

I pointed that out as well, but thanks for the direct links. That debunks their debunking and also points how poor the editing was or how clearly the intent was to mislead.

Can we demand the Editor make a retraction?

YungRu

People will believe anything for the sake of their own confirmation bias.

ada1989

I'll start: first, no explanation given for the baby pictures on Alefantis' Instagram. But I think they sort of alluded to it when they hid Madeleine's face - they will say they "protect" children and their images. But Madeleine's image is so well-known and certainly public, why would they do that? I'll put some more ideas together soon. But it certainly looks like they are losing the war!

derram

https://archive.is/0trLo :

Dissecting the #PizzaGate Conspiracy Theories - The New York Times

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