DarkMath

"could see the apartment from where they were dining"......I think this was debunked by Richard Hall. I'm not sure though. I've seen maps of that resort and where the restaurant was and the view from the restaurant to the McCann's rental is blocked by a tennis court or something like that.

carmencita

As some of you may remember, Maddy had coloboma just as Soros does. Her mother had IVF and as I read on here that probably Soros is the father. Her reported father Gerry had some CP scrubbed from his computer by the police as I also read on here from a report. This was quite a while ago. Coloboma is a very rare anomaly and so as we all have read in some posts that the elite want and need blood to stay younger. This is a problem for a blood match. So I believe they have solved the problem by using IVF and compensating the mother. Now I do not have sources for all of this but I do have a good memory. I believe we will never know whether the Podesta bros. were ever in Praia del Luz because they are both lobbyists and their flight records are not kept, which I believe is also true for ambassadors. As far as Freud's involvement, I think he read about it and being a pedophile, what a sexual charge he would get to have the parents come to dinner. Getting so close to the story is almost living it. I imagine there is a huge thrill involved in being that near to the parents. Remember how demented these individuals can be. The efits are way to close to be discounted. Soros needed people he could trust completely to carry this out. I believe they stole Maddy for Soros because that would the perfect crime as a cover up. He needed her then, so they were to bring her and if the blood part is true then maybe she fought them. For all we know she may still be alive. Remember she has the DNA of Soros which would be a constant supply of blood. How much blood they need at one time I do not know, so if they need too much, then maybe they had to kill her. That's just my take. The whole mess is beyond chilling and disgusting, no matter how it happened.

AreWeSure

Lobbyists flight records are never kept? That is nonsense. Lobbyists are private citizens.

carmencita

I read it on here a while back. Either Bill Clinton or Obama signed it into law. I am hoping it was Executive Order, then Trump can nix it.

AreWeSure

I can find no evidence for this being true.

The Obama administration was pretty good with regards to lobbyists. http://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/271398-lobbyists-could-make-a-comeback-after-obama

carmencita

I found an article FAA Moves to Limit Blockout System Hiding Private Jet Flights which was from 2011. Someone on here was commenting during a post on the Podesta Bros. and said it would be hard to obtain their flight info since lobbyists are subject to blocking their flights from records. They said that the law was amended and I think it was BO but not sure. I will continue searching.

AreWeSure

Look up BARR. That's what you're referring to. Was not put under Obama, applies to all private flights not just lobbyists

carmencita

Yes, I know it was for some corporate jets as well. I remember discussing this before and someone posted an article confirming it, but I am not savvy enough to save those things.

AreWeSure

It's not" as well"

There are no special rules for lobbyists. If they are blocking their flight records they are taking advantage of an option available to ALL private jets that has existedfor 17 years.

carmencita

I know. I just mentioned that because it was pertaining to what we were discussing. Corporate jets are included.

AreWeSure

That article is not about lobbyists

SIMONBARROW

Richard D. Hall is very perverse. He only likes conspiracies he has discovered himself. If it's something other people have discovered, he's often dismissive in the extreme. He's also highly selective in the subjects he chooses to investigate and, if it's not something he's decided to investigate, it's a hoax and just a way of pulling the wool over people's eyes. He also likes telling people that nothing they do will make a difference, for example, he told people not to vote in the Brexit referendum, which he said was pointless, because even if Britain left the EU it would leave the corrupt British system of government still in place.

WhyAserverWasBuilt

where did he get the money to make the movie? his own? somebody else's? Noreen gosch gets screwed a lot going on TV and such, they always go against her rules, and bring her lying husband into the interview. it was great she was able to reach out and get people who care to fund the movie, Who Took Johnny?. So I wonder where the money came from for this guys 'McCann movie'.

Watcher_Down

To put it simply Richard D Hall doesn't want his own Madeleine McCann narrative diluted by PG. Ok the guy has spent a lot of time & money not to mention his own resources putting together his version of the McCann case. Which he is quite convinced is one of death & disposal of the body rather than abduction. The evidence of the cadaver dogs does tend to skew it in this direction. RDH is always in demand of 'evidence' to substantiate any statement and the irrevocable evidence of the dogs seems to stand up. However the controversial assumptions he goes on to make concerning various members and ex-members of the British secret service and the media not to mention powerful people with government connections has yet to be proven. A seldom mentioned fact concerning Madeleine is that she was an IVF conceived child, along with both of her parents being doctors. If we accept the fact that this is a case of a death and body disposal, could it also include organ-harvesting as there are also questions as to who supplied the sperm for the conception, and was she 'made to order'? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-487063/I-AM-Madeleines-dad-Gerry-McCann-rejects-claims-sperm-donor-used-IVF.html

https://archive.is/d6O8v

SIMONBARROW

Good summary of Hall's views. Of course, the Podestas could have acquired Madeleine's dead body rather than abducted a live Madeleine and the explanations why they might have wanted a dead child's body are numerous.

gerrycan

I am going to have to go back and check, but i am sure that these efits were made by a US private investigator while allegedly interviewing a couple from N Ireland. He basically ripped the McCanns off.As for Freud, odious as the man was, I don't find his involvement surprising at all. What I do find surprising is the way he is alleged to speak to Kate McCann, the mother, and how she reacted. As far as little Maddie is concerned, the dogs do not lie, and they say there was blood on the floor at the window and a body in the cupboard, as well as blood in their hire car. Doesn't look like she was abducted by anyone, but rather died in the apartment.

gerrycan

In so far as the Podesta bros not being there at the time, I believe that Richard is 100% correct. What is more incriminating is that the Efits were made some years after the event by an investigator that was on the run from the DoJ in the US, and seems to have used the situation to fire a warning shot across the bow of those who were after him. IOW - you come after me, and I know who and what you are and I will take you down with me. Hence the likeness to the Podestas. It is actually more incriminating when you think about it. Why the fuck would the POdesta bros who are rich be prowling round streets in Portugal kidnapping children themselves when we know that there is a huge operation there who they can simply purchase one from?? Wake the fuck up please.

SIMONBARROW

I think the Podestas enjoy getting their hands dirty. I think it's part of what they enjoy. If you get other people to do your dirty work for you all the time, aren't you missing out on half the 'fun'?

gerrycan

you know, the fact that you and I are even considering that as a possibility says everything that needs to be said about this whole shit storm and these odious pieces of filth. I wouldn't discount anything any more. Including their ability to plunge to further depths of depravity. I do still believe that the undeniable likeness, especially the presence of the mole indicates that the person who produced these drawings knew exactly who the Podestas were and more importantly what they are.

newworldahead

Ok, if you say so. But what do you think of the rest of his points?

gerrycan

Honestly, I think he's full of it. He clearly hasn't looked at the issue at all. He tends to jump the gun at times and over stretches. He did it with 911 in a big way and had to retract a lot. However, in his favour, I believe him to be well meaning and for that reason I would welcome the dialogue, and encourage it. He needs put straight on the pizzagate issue, and I hope he will similarly correct himself on this issue as he has on others, in time.

tamaman

Thank you for this.

Antonius

What a fuckup this Richard D. Hall character is. Where is the proof that she is JA's GOD-DAUGHTER?

Fateswebb

We know who she is, who her parents are and yes they are close to James so it's not inconceivable that she is, her name is Caris Cunningham, the question now is she still alive since nobody has seen any recent photos of her in something like a year and a half or more..

DarkMath

I totally agree SnideLemon. The most convincing evidence was the cadaver dog signalling in the apartment and also in the McCann's rental car. First of all dogs don't lie. Secondly they signaled in the apartment AND car which pretty much eliminates the coincidence of some other corpse being in either place.

The McCann's didn't leave their 3 kids alone while they went to dinner. That's absurd. The parents were both Doctors, it's hard to believe they'd be that careless. They staged the discovery.

DustyRadio

I haven't seen the documentary as I said, but I wouldn't rule out the parents as killers, accidental or intentional. However, their being doctors means nothing in the light of pedophike rings and sex trafficking. There are many doctors who have been exposed as pedos and sick fucks. They also being in that club wouldn't be beyond the realm of possibility.

militant

It sounds like he's trying to convince himself. He mentions only a tiny fraction of the clues/leads and on top of that he's pretty bad at trying to debunk them.

Candygram_for_Mongo

Many sources are intent on dismissing anything and everything without evidence. It's a major clue. We know people won't just admit the evil exists. It's how they react that gives them away.

quantokitty

What an idiot! But then some pro-pedophilia nutjob would take on the job of botching an investigation of Madeleine McCann. It makes sense. Especially since he can't even read: http://archive.is/hiU2N It says: #chickenlovers. Look, I don't mean to burst anyone's bubble, but things aren't this simple. You can't think: "Oh, great! This guy is doing a documentary on Madeleine McCann so he must be trying to seek the truth and on our side" anymore than you can trust that the baby pictured is James The Majestic Ape Alefantis' Goddaughter. It doesn't work that way. This guy sounds like a complete disinformationist and a real c nt and douchebag. F ck him and his movie.

think_whatif

This Richard D. Hall?

From the html on his site:

<meta name="description" content="Believe none of what you hear and only half of waht ( sic ) you see. Exposing the lies in our mainstream media." />

These are topics listed under RESEARCH

  • Madeleine McCann
  • 911 Radar & Video
  • 7/7 Bombings
  • Energy Research
  • Animal Mutilation
  • Sussex Mutilation Case
  • Crop Circles
  • Berwyn UFO Case
  • Lincolnshire Triangle

These are listed under RECOMMENDED

  • UFO Truth Magazine
  • Terror on The Tube
  • 7/7 Ripple Effect
  • Check The Evidence
  • Madeleine McCann
  • Disclosure Project
  • Neil Sanders
  • Check the Evidence

For a guy who is so "open minded" and interested in difficult to prove subjects, I find it interesting how easily it is for him to dismiss Pizzagate.

It's obviously a well thought out opinion.

He leaves himself room to be incorrect, which is good because he does get some things wrong. This tends to cause me to want to disregard his research.

Off the top of my head, he gets things like Tony Podesta not owning any controversial Djurdevic art. He does, this one and I'm certainly no puritan but taken in context it's just another red-flag data-point.

He also gets the "#chickenlovers" thing wrong. As most here are aware, It is a euphemism for pedophilia .

I'm sure I could go on and find more errors in Hall's research, but...I won't.

ZalesMcMuffin

That photo... there are 8 girls arranged like 8 slices of pizza, and the walls of the pool remind me a bit of the walls of a pizza box.

Subjective impression, but it creeped me out a bit.

dickface8

People are just so damn smug and arrogant and think they've got it all figured out when they don't even know the half of it. It's quite pathetic.

Markb63

Exactly

newworldahead

I started watching the documentary but I have not finished it yet... 4 hours is pretty long!

He may be right about the Podestas not involved in McCann dissaperance, I don't know. But what upset me is the way he dismisses everything in PG without much arguments.

smokemirrors

Hes a paid shill and I just wish people would wake up to it.

The_Kuru

I'll make a guess at what the "Chicken Lover" thing means: Alefantis bought the kid a stuffed chicken on that day ( it's in one of the pics with the baby and also captioned chicken lover ) so he could put the double entendre out there for the amusement of his pedo friends without raising suspicions with the parents or at least the mom.

militant

( it's in one of the pics with the baby and also captioned chicken lover )

Link?

Z11Mama

From all I have seen, this is common. No on seems to discuss it. The purposeful detractions. Like gifts of things to suck on.

The_Kuru

Here's what he says about the e-fits:

The e-fits of alleged Madeleine suspect cannot possibly be the “Podesta brothers”. Each of the two e-fits were constructed by two different people and are two persons recollections of ONE alleged suspect. So the two e-fits are not two people. They are in fact the same person. This means the e-fits are unreliable because they look so different.

That is ridiculous because why would he believe that there is only one abductor when the e-fits look so different? Why wouldn't he suspect that the witnesses were describing two different abductors who were in on it together?

AreWeSure

The police have always described the e-fits as the same person. They have also described this person as between 20-40 years old. That is certain.

So he does have logic when he says the efits are unreliable because they are intended to be the same person.

Now I am not certain about this part, but I believe they known it's one person because that one person was seen by a couple and that the efits are in the individual recollections of the couple. She worked on one efit and he worked on the other. That fact that different eyewitness remember or describe details different is not unusual at all and happens way more often than you would guess.

Alpo

The origin of the e-fits themselves is mysterious and suspicious. They were the work of Henri Exton, a former British intelligence agent who worked for a private investigation company hired by the McCanns. They were suppressed from public view for 5 years. It has also been said that the Irish couple could not possibly have given a good description of the man they said they saw, based on the fact that they had only glimpsed him many months before. So why do the e-fits bear an uncanny resemblance to the Podesta brothers?

The_Kuru

The provenance of the e-fits is a shambles. You're right it's suspicious as hell. How was this whole McCann matter brought to our attention? Was it the anonymous guy claiming to be an FBI agent at 4chan? More suspiciousness.

If the Podestas were there, I think they were set up or more correctly their presence used as an opportunity for someone to plot an abduction and put their faces out there as suspects ensuring that the case would never be concluded without dragging the Podestas into it. Which means they can never conclude the case.

The person behind the scheme would have to have deep knowledge of psychology and government workings and he'd have to know that the Podestas were coming so he could set the thing up.

IF THEY WERE THERE. Otherwise I only got a nice Hollywood script in the making.

SIMONBARROW

The so-called eyewitness is not the real source. The e-fits are taken from photos.

Alpo

I think you're right.

crazimal

very possible the images were inserted into the tabloid news (where they first surfaced, NOT via an official police release) by someone who either knew the podestas were involved, but was constrained from naming them (by for example, the US/U.K. special relationship), or placed by someone who wanted to make a warning to the podestas for another reason. In either case, such a person would most likely be in a U.K. Government/intelligence position.

Imagine U.K. authorities get wind podestas are involved, recognize they're high powered and part of US intel community, therefore have to go through their oversight, who is told by Whitehall no fucking way, you are not questioning them, Obama henchman and the #1 lobbyist of the folks that own half the City. But somebody you might call a police or U.K. Intel "media liaison" or "advisor" is pissed, has edits made and slipped under the door of the tabs. That is how that could go, and is very likely approximately what did happen. One way or another someone was putting out the message that the podestas would not remain untouchable forever.

Alpo

Very plausible scenario. I don't think we ever had an explanation of why they were suppressed, or why the were released at the time they were.

bucketoftea

It would be the strangest coincidence ever, wouldn't it? It's always been very suspicious the way the UK government became involved. They flew the McCanns their own PR/Spin doctor to Portugal, and loads of money.

B_dog

Exactly. How could anyone be certain of the number and appearance of those involved?

The 'John Podesta' e-fit looks like a flattering portrait. The 'Tony Podesta' e-fit even includes his mole, but on the wrong side of his forehead. Those e-fits are simply too dead on to be dismissed so blithely. Now, if it could be proven the Podestas were not in Portugal when the abduction occurred, that would be serious exculpatory evidence. If they were in Portugal, and as alleged at pedo Clement Freud's house near the site of the abduction, they should be under investigation and being questioned -- if not arrested already.

One theory which seemed possible to me suggested Scotland Yard intentionally sketched the Podestas knowing they were involved, but too connected to be brought to justice. The poster further speculated various nations' intelligence services know the powerful pedos in other nations and there is a sort of truce. As in, you leave ours alone, we leave yours alone. Clearly, many UK elites have unclean hands in the realm of pedophilia.

crazimal

Yes I was one of those posters, re-outlined my suspicions in this thread just now

Drnoway

It is really so. This is the biggest mistake i have seen among the pizzagate evidence. You can check it out on old news.

They look different because the human memory and eywitnesses are not very reliable. There are many psychological studies made on the subject. I am not a chill, im just trying to point out this mistake that can be used against pizzagate investigation. The Madeleine case is a dead end, there is no way that there can be new evidence found after these years.

SIMONBARROW

The e-fits are not based on eyewitness recollections. They are clearly taken from actual photos of the Podesta brothers, which have been photoshopped, for example, by reversing Tony Podesta's head, so as to make them look a little different. Why this was done, no one seems to have a clue, and I don't either.

quantokitty

This isn't true. Elizabeth Smart's younger sister Mary Katherine sat with a sketch artist and that drawing was used by a private investigator to identify that POS Emmanuel. The police obviously didn't want to find Elizabeth, and if the parents had your attitude, they wouldn't have gotten their daughter back. It's the same with Jon Benet. There's no doubt that a pedophile ring knows who murdered that little girl. It's on video somewhere.

SIMONBARROW

This is simply not possible. Anyone who saw either one of the Podestas could not have seen the other at the same time and, even if they did, it would be impossible for them to remember both faces with this level of accuracy on the basis of a mere passing glimpse. The e-fits are from photos. The eyewitness story is a lie.

quantokitty

Of course, it's possible. Police officers do it all the time. Some witnesses are bad, others are. You would have said a nine-year-old girl was unreliable. Since you don't know the witnesses, whether there was more than one, you're blowing smoke out your ass.

SIMONBARROW

You are accepting a lie and don't like it when someone points out to you that it has to be a lie. For heaven's sake, we are supposed to believe that the witness even observed a tiny mole on Tony Podesta's forehead (but just put it on the wrong side). We've got two people here who are obviously the Podestas and a witness who only ever saw one person. How did they manage to also create a basically correct impression of that person's brother? This witness is clearly psychic! So take a deep breath and get real.

quantokitty

Wow, you get yourself all worked up when concocting a fantasy. And you're leaving out the third pic of Weiner. Sorry, the two men you love most are prime suspects per a witness or witnesses. I know they're your heroes, but it' how it goes. They got caught. Accept it.

dickface8

Please everyone, look up "Waardenburg syndrome eyes", and go back and check the post titled "Congenital Anomaly Register and Information Service (CARIS) JAMES" from about 12 hours ago. This is absolutely an important potential lead!

carmencita

I agree. It made me so aware now of their eyes. Also the CARIS makes a lot of sense to me as well. Waardenburg eyes are seen in many of the pictures on this site.

DarkMath

Richard Hall said that because there's a mountain of evidence that the McCann's covered up Madeleine's accidental death. He has a 4 HOUR documentary on it and it's very clear there was some sort of cover-up.

So naturally any accusations from PizzaGate that the Podesta's were involved or that girl in the photo is an older Madeleine McCann are dubious.

What is NOT dubious are the 2 efits that match John and Tony Podesta. A lot of people think they were used as models for the eFit because some people in high places wanted to fuck with the Podesta's. As in the eFits hit two birds with one stone. They helped cover up Madeleine's accidental death AND helped cast suspicion on the Podesta's as pedophiles. Why? I have no idea but that's one of the theories.

DustyRadio

I haven't seen this and will have to watch it. Is there any way the McCann's would have sold their daughter to these creeps and they all tried to make it look like an abduction? That would explain a lot.

SIMONBARROW

If they're part of a cult or network this could just have been business as usual.

DarkMath

"sold their daughter".......I highly doubt it. Think of Occam's Razor. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one. And that is Madeleine probably died from some tragic but innocent reason like taking too much cough medicine or whatever. The parent's freaked out and didn't want to spend the rest of their lives in a Portuguese jail so they faked the abduction story.

smokemirrors

um, WRONG. Thats what they WANT you to think. Goes much deeper than that, if only I could pin point HOW. Lying McCanns have way too much of a shady past and current shady links to powers that be and the highest paid, most ferocious lawyers in the world for it to be a simple case of 'accidental overdose.'

Someone needs to waterboard those two to get the truth out of them. Kate McCann's first words upon discovering Madeline was missing were "They've Taken Her..".

Never forget.

DarkMath

Why would 2 doctors leave their 3 children alone while they went for dinner and drinks? Do you have kids? Madeleine's siblings were as young as 2 I think. They were very young. It's inconceivable any parent outside a trailer park in the Florida pan-handle would ever do that.

reasonedandinformed

A plausible theory.

newworldahead

This is what I believe too. At least it is a possibility.

dickface8

Everytime these guys are put on the spot they come out with a terribly half assed and selective "debunking" while failing to address the other 1000 things that need explaining. They have nothing, this is the only tactic they can use.

Markb63

They are blinded and can not be convinced.

reasonedandinformed

In this case, more likely in on the whole thing (not blinded).