sponiatowski

Look at the history of the Catholic Church and you need look no further than the Inquisition to find evidence of abuse and torture. I remember a nun once told our classroom "if God was willing to sacrifice his only begotten son, just think what I can do for you if you don't behave". I know there are a lot of Christians concerned about this issue, but if they ever recommend Christianity as being the solution to ritual abuse and pedophilia, I'll tell them that any Savior that mouths the words "suffer the children to come onto me" is no Savior of mine.

Psalm100

And it's "come UNTO me," not "come onto me." That just means for the children to come to Him, something absolutely innocent.

sponiatowski

Was God's sacrifice of his only begotten son a "good thing"? I can almost hear a pedophile quoting the same phrase as they try to buy a child from an impoverished parent. Prayers won't help this situation if prayers are being used as the punishment for pedophile priests, though on a personal level it can prepare you for battle. There is a Pope involved here. That won't be a good thing going forward. He'll mix lies with the truth and confuse everyone. You need to step away from God to fight evil.

Psalm100

"Was God's sacrifice of his only begotten son a "good thing"?"

From my perspective the answer is both. It was costly to God to give His Son for mankind's sin, but for me and anyone who will accept it, Jesus' death atoned for my and their sin.

"I can almost hear a pedophile quoting the same phrase as they try to buy a child from an impoverished parent."

The full quote, though, is "for of such is the Kingdom of Heaven." When asked who is the greatest in Heaven, Jesus set a little child before them all. And He said we must be born again and become as little children to enter Heaven. On what a pedophile might say, they might say anything, or misuse just about anything that can be said.

"Prayers won't help this situation if prayers are being used as the punishment for pedophile priests..."

Something made clear throughout the Bible is that the choice of certain people to be wolves in sheep's clothing makes no difference in some senses. If a pastor is a wolf, but someone comes to believe in Jesus through his preaching, that person's faith is real. If when they learn their pastor is a wolf they decide to abandon God's way and act like the wolf, then that will be their decision.

On the Catholic Pope saying that pedophile priests should be sentenced to a life of prayer, it sounded like a punishment to me when prayer isn't a punishment. Perhaps he didn't mean it that way, but it was troubling nonetheless. I'm not Catholic, and believe many of the Catholic Church's doctrines aren't true. On fighting evil, I believe it's necessary to depend on God to fight it. There is evil in each of us, but God offers us rescue from it.

sponiatowski

Maybe it is just my Catholic upbringing. I was taught the only true religion is Catholicism because it is the only Church on earth that was founded by Jesus. No other religion counted. So I wonder, how can religion solve this problem, when for the past 40 years (and more, who knows how many years before it was reported) it has been a major player in the problem and maybe even the originator of the problem?

And how is our government supposed to solve the problem, when it is within the government that we find corruption that facilitates the problem? If the government is corrupt, and religion is corrupt, who is best to solve this problem? And doesn't it play into the pedophile's hands if we do nothing and wait for the Divine Prescience to act? And if God is the answer, why hasn't God acted before the children were victimized? In other words, if God is the solution, why has he let the people closest to Him be the problem?

I'm taking it as a sign that mankind has to act and act with prudence, and if it isn't mankind that is supposed to act, then we have been praying to the wrong God, an impotent God, or maybe even the religion of inertia, a religion designed to protect the perpetrators of the evil we're trying to fight. In other words, following the religion of the pedophiles is not going to resolve the pedophilia problem. Doing nothing plays into the pedophiles' hands, and it is the people who created the wrong God, the impotent God, or the God of Inertia that tell us to kneel and pray and wait for this Divine Intervention that never comes in time to save the innocent. And didn't even act to save His own, innocent Son.

Well, if he hasn't intervened before the children were enslaved, raped and sacrificed, he won't intervene now. And it is mankind that must resolve the issue. And I do not mean vigilante justice, for no one has the right to harm, judge or condemn anyone but our very own courts of law within the American justice system. I say, Pray, if you must, to clear your head for what you need to do. Support dutifully those who are moving to resolve the problem. Judge the actors by the strength of their evidence and the outcome of their pursuits, and thank no one but those who have solved the problem. Let the worshiping of the spirit that has guided them to the desired outcome completely up to the actors.

In other words, don't offer poison as an antidote to the poison, and don't give thanks and praise to the poisoner once the real antidote is administered by the rightful receiver of gratitude.

Psalm100

Have you looked at the passage in context? While "suffer" isn't used that way anymore in modern English, it's still clear what's meant.

I don't think anyone, even anyone in the Catholic Church, has tried to say that "suffer" in that passage refers to the children.

What's going on is that children are trying to approach Jesus, and His disciples try to stop them, apparently thinking Jesus is too busy doing more important things with more important people to be bothered with children, but Jesus says to His disciples, "suffer the little children to come unto Me, for of such is the Kingdom of Heaven." It's obvious in context that Jesus is just correcting His disciples and telling THEM to allow the children to come to Him, and his actions suggest that children are important too, even though His disciples don't think so.

sponiatowski

With that explanation it is fine, but so many people are told to accept the Bible word for word...and it is possible pedophiles transcribed, interpreted, and translated the Bible. So many of these child abusers have been religious people. They must be reading things into the Bible the wrong way or using it as a way to justify their crimes. It stands to reason. Heck, all the Amish or Catholics have to do to have their sins forgiven is confess their sins to the Elders or a Priest. The systems set up haven't been working, have they?

Psalm100

"With that explanation it is fine, but so many people are told to accept the Bible word for word...and it is possible pedophiles transcribed, interpreted, and translated the Bible."

Yes, and I agree about accepting the Bible word for word, but one passage has to be understood in light of God's entire Word. On pedophiles possibly having worked on the Bible, it's possible, but they wouldn't have gotten away with changing anything. There's actually a passage that may talk about what will happen to people who sexually abuse children. Jesus says that whoever offends any of the little ones who believe in Him, it would be better for a millstone to be tied around their neck and they be drowned in the sea.

"So many of these child abusers have been religious people. They must be reading things into the Bible the wrong way or using it as a way to justify their crimes. It stands to reason."

Well, first "religious" is a vague term. But for the sake of simplicity, let's only speak of professing Christians. People who say they believe in God but then do horrible things even though, if they really believe, they should believe God knows and will punish them, just don't really believe. As Jesus said, there will be wolves in sheep's clothing. Just because some who seem to be sheep are actually wolves doesn't mean that there aren't real sheep. There are. And people who do evil things find ways to justify to themselves what they do, or just don't care that they're doing evil. Sometimes that involves religion in some way but most of the time it doesn't seem to. There are pedophile rings exposed all the time and the vast majority don't seem to be based on Christianity in any way. On the Amish and Catholics, I don't know about how the Amish actually are, but as I said, I do know some about the Catholic Church and think many of its beliefs aren't true. On forgiveness of one's sins, it's not necessarily as easy as that. God knows people's hearts and goes by what's in them. He isn't fooled by someone just asking for forgiveness to get out of earthly trouble.

SecureYourSeats

That was a misunderstanding of King James English. What "suffer" in this context means is, "put up with" or "permit". Look it up for yourself. How can someone object to Jesus in this statement, recognizing the rights and dignity of children?

sponiatowski

Still. The mandela effect has stuck to "suffer the childreen" and maybe it was the Catholic Monks that wanted it interpreted that way. We all know about some Catholic monks and priests, don't we.